IDempiere/FullMeeting20150826

⇐ Table of Contents | Full Meeting Minutes | Full Meeting 2015-08-26

CarlosRuiz: Good morning
a42niem: hi Carlos
a42niem: can you look at 2780 and 2792 ?
CarlosRuiz: sure a42niem
a42niem: i have the feeling that a number of these conversions will be coming bit by bit
a42niem: there is for example 2314 and 2689
a42niem: should we maybe create one "big" ticket about "accessability improvement" and relate these issues to it?
a42niem: thank you :)
aguerra: good morning!!!
CarlosRuiz: Hi aguerra
CarlosRuiz: a42niem, yes - one ticket covering all these is good
hieplq: hi CarlosRuiz, please help me review some issue:https://idempiere.atlassian.net/browse/IDEMPIERE-2784?filter=12601
hieplq: IDEMPIERE-2789 maybe help improve performance
CarlosRuiz: ok - reviewing now 2790
allgood: hi carlos
allgood: i am preparing a document to address that fine/interest issue we talked last week
allgood: do you have any suggestion where I can place the configuration of the default charges for fine and interest?
allgood: (or anybody)
hieplq: @CarlosRuiz, i can take 2790, you can save time for other issue :D
hieplq: i can redo it in my local and will fix it
CarlosRuiz: ok, let me add the patch solving the first issue
CarlosRuiz: allgood, maybe a wiki page
allgood: CarlosRuiz: i will put it in a wiki
allgood: i was asking where in the system I can place the configuration for the charges that will be used for fine and interests
allgood: firstly i tought in doing the accounting directly, no charges
allgood: then you suggested to use charges instead
egil_: good morning everyone
CarlosRuiz: Hi egil_
allgood: if doing the accounting way, it should be easy to post against B_INTERESTEXP_ACCT and B_INTERESTREV_ACCT
CarlosRuiz: allgood, I see in C_DunningLevel
CarlosRuiz: charge and interest flag and amount
CarlosRuiz: but is not defined which charge to use
egil_: hi @CarlosRuiz
egil_: @druiz i was talking with the people in the university
egil_: and they are in vacation rigth now and because of that there is nobody to help us in the days of the conference
allgood: CarlosRuiz: I was thining in a document property, for AP Payment document, what do you thing?
allgood: and AR Payment also.
CarlosRuiz: what do you mean? adding two charge_id columns to c_doctype?
allgood: something like that
allgood: i think i need to define the charge to be automatically allocated when receiving fine and interests, don't know the best place for this
allgood: it could be a tab that only shows when doctype is payments, avoiding overhead in c_doctype
allgood: but this wyay tere is another table
allgood: CarlosRuiz: I don't think a configured charge is a good idea for a contribution to the upstream. Your suggestion of tabbed charges on payment seems to be better.
allgood: but it doesn't address the need to define fine and interest rates in payment terms and schedule.
CarlosRuiz: ah interesting
CarlosRuiz: maybe you can define the charge on the payment term schema
allgood: this can be done
allgood: making it mandatory if defined the rates
allgood: talking here with my colleagues we discussed how intuitive would be to have FineAmt and InterstAmt on payment main windows
allgood: instead of tabs
allgood: I think that this is best for reports
allgood: if the charge is defined for fine and interest, the tabbed charges idea can be also be made for other charges
allgood: manually entered
allgood: CarlosRuiz: I think I have finished the idea. Please take a look and make some comments: https://goo.gl/PzNwqL
CarlosRuiz: thanks allgood
allgood: I want to implement this in a way that it can be contributed to idempiere, so, if you think that anything there block this contribution, please help me address it.
allgood: i will lunch now... will see the history when back
CarlosRuiz: allgood, on the last comment - is not OverUnderAmt - but WriteoffAmt
allgood: there where i selected?
allgood: as i understand, writeoff is the value that we decide not to collect from the customer... am I right?
CarlosRuiz: also - I've seen another way to manage this - and is about a process generating debit notes for fines and interests - instead of doing directly on the payment
allgood: debit notes?
CarlosRuiz: yes, like an invoice
allgood: another window?
allgood: a new one?
CarlosRuiz: no
CarlosRuiz: you could generate an invoice with the charges - fine - and interest
allgood: ah, yes
CarlosRuiz: but in some places that's not called an invoice - but a debit note
allgood: we have this on our brainstorm here
allgood: this can make easier to record not paid fines and interests
allgood: if customer pay the invoice but not the charges, we place an invoice for them
allgood: i really need to go now, will be back in one hour
allgood: thank you
CarlosRuiz: yes - and also easier to negotiate - if you want to adjust the fine
allgood: but, this way I propose, can be done with fines and interests taht is being paid... can the two ideas be combined?
allgood: going... will read your answer latter
druiz: hi egil_, sorry I was afk
egil_: @druiz ok do not worry
egil_: well i was telling you
egil_: that they are on vacation until octuber 1
druiz: Ohh :/, ok I guess we will somehow find a way :D.
allgood: CarlosRuiz: I am back, are you around?
CarlosRuiz: Hi allgood
allgood: i liked the debit note, i think it unnecessary if the fine and interest are paid together with the full value
allgood: but it solved one doubt that is when it is not fully paid and we want to collect it later
CarlosRuiz: or, in some business you calculate monthly the interests - even if the customer doesn't pay
allgood: here in LBR in our bank collection plugin I made an allocation priority, so, if the payee dont pay the full value + fine + interests, it removes from the invoice payment, so the customer ends owing us a fraction of the original invoice.
allgood: on the settings is defined the order that a payment is allocated to capital, fine and interest
allgood: if fine and interest is first, capital will not be fully paid and leave a partialy paid invoice
allgood: but i think that this is too specific.
muriloht: hi
muriloht: @allgood using charges you can get all the financial and accounting things around fine and interest done in a quite easy way
allgood: hi murilo
allgood: did you looked at the document i wrote?
allgood: https://goo.gl/qsa8j1
allgood: we already allocate fines and interests to charges when processing bank collection and are thinking in improving idempiere to have a solution when manually receiving payments that are due and muts include this values.
allgood: *must
muriloht: oh, i'll take a look...
muriloht: to solve that, we have implemented a eventhandler based solution... we created fine and interest fields on payment, payment allocate, allocation form, and other related
allgood: it involves to place the rates in payment terms
muriloht: then, when users fill this field, a eventhandler takes care to do the correct allocation against correct charges defined in a organization level parameter
allgood: this is somewhat the solution i am proposing.
allgood: then CarlosRuiz suggested to create Debit Notes when charges are needed. I think it is useful only when the payment doesn't include the owed charges.
allgood: then I ask if the two solutions can live together
allgood: 1. if payment is full, with fine and interests, make everything in the payment window
allgood: 2. if the payment doesn't include the owed charges, create open debit notes to the customer, so they can be collected later
muriloht: the second case, just to keep in track about the dueamt, alright?
allgood: this can turn reporting on received charges a litle hard
allgood: the second case is with the objective to know that the customer still owes we the charges
allgood: it can be void or reversed if we decide to "forgive" them
muriloht: alright... sounds good... to get this running here, i just needed to modify 1 class from "core" ... everything can be done as a plugin, if u want we can share that idea to make a generic plugin
allgood: this is the idea, most generic possible so it can be used on the mainstream idempire
allgood: muriloht: what changes you did in core
allgood: ?
muriloht: i need to take a look at the code... and then i can export a patch
allgood: great
allgood: i think that the proposal I made can be done without change on the core
allgood: did you read the doc?
jbwiv: anyone aware of a Vagrantfile in existence to install idempiere to a local virtualbox vm?
CarlosRuiz: Hi jbwiv